Minutes of Evidence, Eastern Transvaal Natives Land Committee, October 1917 -- January 1918

Testimony of Saul Msane, Sprinkhaan, and Jonas Mapope before the Eastern Transvaal Natives
Land Committee, October 23, 1917 [Extracts] (Published in Minutes of Evidence, Eastern Transvaal
Natives Land Committee)

SAUL MSANE:

I live at 9, Kruis Street, Johannesburg. I am a Zulu.

I am pleased to be before you. You spoke in your address [referring to the opening remarks of the
Chairman, in which he explained the intent and purpose of the Bill], of the great principle established by Act 27 1913. I wish to remind you. Sir, that when that act was passed we fought against it. I was one of
the delegates sent to Cape Town to represent the case of the natives. We pointed out to Mr. Sauer, the
then Minister for Native Affairs, that the Act pressed severely upon us and we asked that before the Act
was passed a Commission should be sent round the country to ascertain the views of the natives. We
asked the Government not to legislate in the dark, but the Government would not listen to what we said,
and the Act was passed. The Government carried that law knowing well that it took away rights that we
formerly possessed. We were astonished that such a thing should happen under the British flag. After this,
certain men were chosen to go to England and make representations on our behalf. I am one of these
delegates. Then the war spoiled everything. We did not care to press our case whilst our King was troubled
by war. We suspended our agitation, but we have not dropped it. We mean to take it up again so soon as
the war is over.

The principle established by the Act of 1913 is really a travesty of Queen Victoria's Proclamation of 12th
May 1843. It robs us of the rights we enjoyed under that Proclamation. We are surprised that rights given
us by the English should now be taken away again. The war has proved that we are submissive. If we
resist, it is because our great right was taken away from us.

You have come here today, Sir, to speak to these people of the land that will be given to them in various
parts. These natives think this area will be given to them. But the Bill does not say that. It says they will
be given the right to buy. But how are these natives here who have lost all their property to buy? I say
that the authorities do not wish us to have a place where we can settle down quietly. Look at the matter of
the registration of contracts before the Magistrate. Only those who have money with which to buy will go
into the native area. The others will have to stay in the white area. Those who stay wilt find that the
conditions under which they must reside are not the conditions to which we Bantu are accustomed. These
conditions savour of slavery.

Again, take Section 16, Sub-section 17. You will see that the native is deprived of his wife and children.
(The Chairman pointed out that the effect of the section was exactly the contrary.) I am glad to hear you
say that it is not so. I say it is not right to come to natives like these here to-day who do not understand
what is being done, and to expect them to give an opinion on so complicated a matter. The Committees
are meeting this class of people everywhere the most primitive.

Under Section 147 of the Act of Union the Governor-General-in-Council is the supreme chief of the natives.
What we ask is that the Governor-General-in-Council should meet all the natives and discuss this Act with
them and tell them exactly what is being done. When I ask that we people should be able to settle down
quietly I want also that we should live in harmony and help one another.

I refer again to Act 27 of 1913. Out of a total of 143,000,000 morgen within the whole Union, Act 27 of
1913 provides only about 10½ millions for the natives. The Beaumont Commission has added, I think,
another 8â..." millions, bringing it up roughly to 20 million morgen. That is for 4½ millions of natives. The
white people who are 1¼ million, will have the rest. Can you rightly say that there is justice in that? It
makes us think that you don't wish to help us, you want to destroy us. To put all these people and their
increase in one small kraal! I have grown up under the British flag. I know how the British live and act.
This is not the way they act. You are not doing justice to Great Britain.

You will see, Sir, that the Act provides for a South African Native Commission which will be over us, in
other words, we shall be deprived of the protection of Parliament. Parliament will no longer be over us.
You are taking away a right from us. Section 60 of the Act of Union provides that after a Bill has passed
both houses the Governor-General may assent to it or reject it, or reserve it for the Imperial Parliament.
Section 65 gives the King the right to alter a Bill after it has been assented to by the Governor-General.
We went to England under that clause. Now it is proposed to rob us of that right. The law is unjust to us, it
destroys us.

Then, again, we are to have a court of our own and not go to the judges of the Supreme Court. The court
will consist probably of two magistrates or two commissioners, or sub-native commissioners. Here too, we
are deprived of the protection given us by the Act of Union, which provides that the Appellate Division of
the Supreme Court of South Africa shall be the highest court within the Union. There is no provision
enabling us to appeal to that court. Do not then be surprised that we do not approve of the Bill. We cannot
approve of it. Our prayer is that this Act 27 of 1913 is repealed and the Administration Bill be not
proceeded with until after the war. Then when everything is settled a convention can be summoned of all
the chiefs and leaders of the natives to meet the Governor-General-in-Council and evolve what you call a
native policy. (The Chairman at this stage pointed out that the speaker was wrong in regard to the right of
appeal.)

We are very much afraid of this Bill. In the Free State now they are making women carry passes. We urge
that the Government take no further action to have this Bill made law until our people have returned to
this country from Europe and have had an opportunity of discussing the bill. We simply want the thing to
drop until the war is over.

[The Chairman at this stage dealt with the various points raised by the speaker and pointed out to the
meeting the necessity for indicating the area they wanted.]

SPRINKHAAN: Examined by Chairman.

I thank you very much, Sir, today. We are cattle and have come to the kraal. When I left Sekukuniland I
came away from the big kraal. At that time there was no water there. Even now you hear that natives are
leaving Sekukuniland because there is famine.

We discussed this matter with our people and they said to us: "When you go from here tell them we have
no eyes, we are blind." The only eyes we have are the eyes of our Commissioner. He is the one to hear
our grievances.

Today our children are in England for the Government, and while they are away you come here and say
you want to decide the matter of the ground that is to be given to us. I ask if this Bill is to become law
while our children are still in England.

We are very sad when you say we must go away and look for other places in which to live. There are no
other places to go to. Please assist us and let us remain where we are today.

Diamond was my chief, and when he died I buried him there where we live today. If I go away, the white
people will come and plough up his grave. Diamond's last words to me when he died were: "Remain here
where I shall be buried and look after my son."

I cannot say where the boundary ought to go. I wish the Commissioner to speak for me.

JONAS MAPOPE; Examined by Chairman.

I speak to endorse the words of Saul. We heard a little time back that there was another Commission,
which went round the country. When they went back to Parliament we heard what they said there. We saw
that their recommendations were a great mistake. I think that is what Saul means. We stand here today
and say again that those recommendations were a mistake, and I say the authorities make a mistake too
in pressing this legislation. Now we hear there is another Commission that has come with good. I heard of
this at my home in Spelonken.

All that Saul has said we think is right. I say that you should listen to what Saul has said. We don't say
that the Government must not give us an area. But what we say is that we don't want the area at the back
of beyond. We are not afraid of what is today, but of what is to come. You tell us that we will be well
looked after by our Commissioners. If they were all like Colonel Damant here we should be satisfied. We
support him in the matter of the areas. What we refuse is a small area.

Source:

Karis, T & Carter G. M. (1972). From Protest to Challenge: A Documentary History of African Politics in South Africa, 1882-1964, Volume 1: Protest and Hope, 1882-1934. Stanford University: Hanover Press.

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